Trip to Germany
in [Europe]
|
Prev: Paris metro Navigo "decouverte" pass now available for tourists
Next: cost of tobacco in the Canaries?
From: Doesn't Frequently Mop on 12 Oct 2007 15:28 Make credence recognised that on Fri, 12 Oct 2007 12:48:50 -0400, Dave Smith <adavidsmith(a)sympatico.ca> has scripted: >Doesn't Frequently Mop wrote: >> >> >> Let me give you four cases which illustrate why I don't judge comments >> on race: >> >> 1. I like Chinese food (OK) >> 2. I don't like Chinese food (OK) >> 3. I like Chinese people (OK) >> 4. I don't like Chinese people (&$%#ing RACIST!!!!) >> >> >But if you can't see the harm done by makign bigoted comments and >> >jokes in public, far be it from me to interrupt your cognitive >> >dissonance. > > >But what if people of a particular race or culture share an attitude that >is utterly abhorrent to our own moral standards? What if the person comes >from a culture where theft and corruption are serious problems, where the >treat women like third class citizens, allow no dissension and will not >tolerate religious beliefs that differ from their own? Sure, they have put >on a friendly front and be polite and solicitous, but you know that they >have this underlying attitude that is so much at odds with what your >personal views? Sounds like the Japanese. Why should we Anglo-saxons feel so bad about observing by race? Everyone else does it, and that doesn't make it wrong or right. It's just the way it is. It's like a game of Chess really. Once the blacks are out of the way, you've won. -- --- DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com --- --
From: Dave Smith on 12 Oct 2007 16:35 "EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)" wrote: > > >>>But if you can't see the harm done by makign bigoted comments and > >>>jokes in public, far be it from me to interrupt your cognitive > >>>dissonance. > > > > > > > > But what if people of a particular race or culture share an attitude that > > is utterly abhorrent to our own moral standards? > > First define "our"! Ours.... mine. I used the first person as an in individual. Am I, as an individual, not allowed to be upset about people from a culture whose moral and ethical standards are at odds with my own? > More and more, in the U.S., members of > the religious right are defining "America" by their own > narrow, fundamentalist Christian viewpoint. (Even though > our "moral" standards have actually become MORE rather than > less diverse, in actual fact.) I have noticed a general trend toward their arrogance about their personal rights and freedoms..... so long as there personal beliefs are concerned, but to hell with the rights of others who do not agree with them. > > where they > > treat women like third class citizens, allow no dissension and will not > > tolerate religious beliefs that differ from their own? > > Under the Bush administration, "Women's Lib" has been set > back at least fifty years. As to "tolerating religious > beliefs that differ from their own", listen to any > evangelical preacher in the U.S. Most of them would be > right at home with Hitler's "Kinder, Kuchen und Kirche". I am not talking about affirmative action or employment equity. I am talking about basic rights. There are cultures where young women are killed by make family members for having disgraced their families, and some where young girls are circumcised to make sure that, while they may service their husbands, won't be having any fun doing it.
From: Hatunen on 12 Oct 2007 17:28 On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 11:53:34 -0700, "EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)" <evgmsop(a)earthlink.net> wrote: >Under the Bush administration, "Women's Lib" has been set >back at least fifty years. what rubbish. If you had actually been around in 1957 I don't see how you can say that. For instance, compare the number of women in the US Senate to the number in 1957. Or the number of women CEOs of American corporations. Or the number of Protestant ministers. Check the number of female doctors and lawyers today to those in 1957. >As to "tolerating religious >beliefs that differ from their own", listen to any >evangelical preacher in the U.S. Most of them would be >right at home with Hitler's "Kinder, Kuchen und Kirche". I think the reference was to things like female circumcision. -- ************* DAVE HATUNEN (hatunen(a)cox.net) ************* * Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow * * My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
From: Doesn't Frequently Mop on 12 Oct 2007 17:48 Make credence recognised that on Thu, 11 Oct 2007 23:46:54 -0700, Hatunen <hatunen(a)cox.net> has scripted: >On Thu, 11 Oct 2007 16:58:57 -0700, >"EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)" <evgmsop(a)earthlink.net> wrote: >>Hmmmm.... >>1) We may have improved somewhat since the early twentieth >>century, but to the rest of the world (and to many of our >>own citizens) the U.S. is still a nation of comparative >>cultural barbarians! > >Oh, yes. The Europeans displayed their culture in 1914 and again >in 1936 (Spanish civil war, a most cultural affair), and 1935 >(Italy invades Ethiopia, apparently to help the Ethipians learn >to appreciate opera), and let's not neglect all the European >support for Hitler's anti-semitism, shall we?. > >Who else? The pre-war Japanese? Gawd, winding the clock back this far is surreal. Were you guys even alive in 1935? -- --- DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com --- --
From: Hatunen on 12 Oct 2007 17:31
On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 21:28:01 +0200, Doesn't Frequently Mop <deepfreudmoors(a)eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote: >Make credence recognised that on Fri, 12 Oct 2007 12:48:50 -0400, Dave >Smith <adavidsmith(a)sympatico.ca> has scripted: > >>Doesn't Frequently Mop wrote: >>> >>> >>> Let me give you four cases which illustrate why I don't judge comments >>> on race: >>> >>> 1. I like Chinese food (OK) >>> 2. I don't like Chinese food (OK) >>> 3. I like Chinese people (OK) >>> 4. I don't like Chinese people (&$%#ing RACIST!!!!) >>> >>> >But if you can't see the harm done by makign bigoted comments and >>> >jokes in public, far be it from me to interrupt your cognitive >>> >dissonance. >> >> >>But what if people of a particular race or culture share an attitude that >>is utterly abhorrent to our own moral standards? What if the person comes >>from a culture where theft and corruption are serious problems, where the >>treat women like third class citizens, allow no dissension and will not >>tolerate religious beliefs that differ from their own? Sure, they have put >>on a friendly front and be polite and solicitous, but you know that they >>have this underlying attitude that is so much at odds with what your >>personal views? > >Sounds like the Japanese. > >Why should we Anglo-saxons feel so bad about observing by race? >Everyone else does it, and that doesn't make it wrong or right. It's >just the way it is. Because it's not race being dealt with above, it's culture. Americans of Japanese descent don't act like Japan's Japanese. The problem comes from attributing the characteristics of a small portion of a group to all the members of that group. -- ************* DAVE HATUNEN (hatunen(a)cox.net) ************* * Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow * * My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps * |